Curse

Deepjay · Jun 06, 2006, 03:38 AM // 03:38

Hi guys just a quick question - Ive been playing large amounts of RA, and trying to get into TA, but it's hard/frustrating doing it with pug groups - anyhow my question as per topic -

When playing as a boon prot monk build, taking what you would consider to be all the 'normal' skills, do you take in res signets as well? I generally do, though having done quite a large amount of reading on various forums, overlooking various builds, many boon prots dont seem to take any form of res capability.

Whilst i consider myself fairly good at what i do, by no means elite, but a fairly able healer, i can still never guarantee that i can keep someone alive because obviously there's just too many factors, spikes etc, myself being heavily e-denied. Every time a member or two dies, or if its one of those long drawn out fights, i feel like i really *should* have brought a res sig, and those few times i havent, have been abused for not bringing one.

I was curious to know the general thoughts on this.

I find that RA battles for one, especially the longer more skillful ones, where you really do find yourself with two pretty good teams, can be a war of attrition on who can knock out the other teams res capability, making them use up all their res sig charges. So with those in mind, i find it hard to ever not go in without a sig. cheers

dgb · Jun 06, 2006, 04:08 AM // 04:08

No res sig. You res as a monk, you give a nice big opportunity for something esle to die. Aside from that, as a boon prot your bar is tight enough allready without reducing it to seven effective skills.

Back yourself to keep them alive, don't resign yourself to losing them.

Zui · Jun 06, 2006, 04:48 AM // 04:48

Agreed with the above poster.

There are far better things to bring, secondary energy managment, or another healing/protection skill.

Deepjay, if you want to post your build and attributes, I'm sure there would be plenty of people here willing to help you figure out what to drop your res sig for.

Red Locust · Jun 06, 2006, 06:45 AM // 06:45

You probably should carry a sig, although it depends somewhat on your playstyle and build. I prefer to carry sig of devo and use it on guys getting focused. Use that to keep up with degen when you're not kiting, and RoF to keep up with spikes, and people shouldn't be dying that much. I find myself being the primary target a lot of times anyways, so rez sigs won't help me much. Sig of Devotion would be a good substitute imo.

JiggyFly · Jun 06, 2006, 06:53 AM // 06:53

I carry a rez sig, more than ocne I've been blacked out, or was just plain unable to heal because it would have resulted in my death. Then I simpyl just rezzed them back, no big deal. Sure in some cases I don't have the luxury to Rez, but I have 2 other teamates who can easily divert their attention to the rez, and if I do have the time, Great! then I just use my sig. Seldom do I find that 100% of a match has me kiting or needing me to heal that taking 3 seconds out of my time would cause someone to drop dead.

Schorny · Jun 06, 2006, 07:05 AM // 07:05

the general formular of how many res sigs you need is:

expected deaths + 1

how many deaths do you expect you will suffer and still be able to win?

when you got a monk, you normally shouldn't suffer more than 1-2 deaths, because if they can kill you 3-4 or 5 times, why take a monk? you'll be better off with another offensive char to kill them, or with some better defense if one monk doesn't cut it.

That's why I expect 1 or maybe 2 deaths in TA when running some non extreme build (like 4 warriors or so

) and that means: 3 res sigs is more than enough. Always keep in mind that you gimp your ability to heal if you carry a res sig.

Normally I don't lose because we ran out of sigs but because our enemy just plain defeated us.

Red Locust · Jun 06, 2006, 07:23 AM // 07:23

Keep in mind that you can instantly cancel your rez sig and cast spells a split second later, plus it's 4v4 so it's fairly trivial to anticipate the enemy's moves. The time required to use the sig isn't really an issue, the slot it takes up is.

SAQ · Jun 06, 2006, 07:34 AM // 07:34

If you are a capable monk, you don't bring res sig, but if you aren't capable, it's better if you bring a res sig.

Servant of Kali · Jun 06, 2006, 09:13 AM // 09:13

Depending on a team build, rez or no rez can be equally good. When you run into heavy hex degen build, boon prot wont really help that much, but rez sig will.

yesitsrob · Jun 06, 2006, 01:01 PM // 13:01

No res sig. You're tied enough for slots how it is on a boon prot, and considering the "attack the monk" mentality of the Random Arenas you'll find yourself tanking damage more often than not.

I find, a lot of the time other casters on my team die because they refuse to kite thus using up all my energy on just healing them... in such a case, I'd rather not waste a sig on them anyway and would prefer to find another team >_>.

I can't really think of a reason to take a sig on a boon prot, if someone dies that isn't you, you have 2 people with sigs ready to res him, rather you should have... But I'm not one to adjust my build to compensate for others lack of ability to res

Byron · Jun 06, 2006, 03:38 PM // 15:38

I could see the possibility of a full healer bringing a res sig, maybe. But in the case of a boon, I personally can't get enough skill slots. Were there 10 slots, my boon would probably still not have a res sig equipped. So, no - no boon should ever have a res of any kind IMO.

And that's not to mention, a sig means 3 seconds of time when you're not healing.

fallot · Jun 06, 2006, 04:24 PM // 16:24

I'm of two minds about bringing a res on a boon prot in RA, but anywhere else I'd never consider it.

jummeth · Jun 06, 2006, 05:22 PM // 17:22

Nah, I don't think theres space, take an extra e-man skill, thus stopping a teammate from dying is better.
You probably will have somebody on your case, I very rarely get 2 (nvm 3) seconds rest as soon as the 2 teams engage (unless my team is rolling them, which makes this problem a moot point)

The biggest problem is just the lack of space. Boon-prots are expensive to run and need a lot of energy management.

ender6 · Jun 06, 2006, 07:22 PM // 19:22

/no res sig

-No room on your bar.
-Shouldn't be taking time out to rez, if ppl are dying you best be healing.
-if your need a 3rd rez, you are most likely doomed anyways.

holden · Jun 06, 2006, 09:04 PM // 21:04

no res sig.

if someone died suck it up and make sure no one else does. you can't do that if you're using a res sig.

Deepjay · Jun 07, 2006, 06:08 AM // 06:08

Thanks for the advice guys - was much appreciated. I did in fact drop the res sig and brought in an additional e-management skill(bringing mine up to 3).

I was running this build:

reversal of fortune
guardian
remove condition
res sig
protective spirit
inspire hex
energy drain(e)
divine boon

And have since swapped out protective spirit for contemplation of purity, and the res sig for reveal hex.

Playing quite a few games of RA last night, I found this to be a very comfortable build to me, and with the new e-man skill in there, basically the strongest build ive used yet. I guess a build is never 100% complete, but at this stage, im enjoying this one, cheers

JiggyFly · Jun 07, 2006, 07:53 AM // 07:53

I like to assume the worst case scenario especially in RA, which in my opinion is getting 3 c-spacers without Rez Sigs. But I still look at it as even the newest player ever to PvP with DP is still better then what my 8th skill would have been, and it's RA so there's a good chance I'm going to get a new player who doesn't know when to back-off, or just a good ol' Leroy either way there's a very good chance I'm going to get a player who gets themself into an unhealable situation, so between an 8th skill that won't save them anyways and a Rez Sig, I choose life.

torquemada · Jun 07, 2006, 07:58 AM // 07:58

For RA, Mantra of Recall should be slightly better (more sustainable), otherwise looks good. If it works for you, cheers and have fun.

Also /notsign on RA/TA rez on monk, usually we are ressing monk, not otherway around. Monk's usually first to go off (with notable examples of Me or E if opportunity demands) and even if not, you will be interrupted to death trying to rez.

Egg Shen · Jun 07, 2006, 04:38 PM // 16:38

At least in RA/TA, I'd make room for a sig. Usually it takes fairly focused fire to drop somebody if you're a decent monk in RA/TA. I find that if somebody gets killed, either because they run me out of energy (thanks assassins

) or because I'm blacked out or energy drained, or maybe they pull off a good ol' four man spike, there's very often a brief moment where they are finding a new target or building adrenaline where I can safely get off the most amazingly efficient (albeit one time) 'heal' in the game.

And citing interrupts as a reason NOT to bring a sig is just crazy. Using that logic, nobody should bring a sig because it might get interrupted.

In fact, the presence of interrupts is actually an argument in favor of everybody bringing a sig because it's sometimes necessary for two people to attempt to rez at the same time in order to plow through a ranger interrupter's skills.

jummeth · Jun 07, 2006, 05:05 PM // 17:05

I still do not see (even for a good monk) how they would find the time to spend 3 seconds resing, unless they were rolling the team anyway.

I like E-drain over MoR since you can use it as an utility skill, I run channeling to further help my energy. Its useful because I normally have a couple if not three people trying to bash my head in.

Boon-prots are actually very resiliant to warrior pressure. If there is 1 war on me, I can happily keep myself in shape and keep the team in shap, as long as they are not frenzy healsiging etc. 2 Wars, I'd have to devote more attension to myself, but the bright side is, wahey, my team outnumbers the others 3 to 2.